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/ Culture and History / Blue Mosque in Armenia (Read 4401 times) back 1 [2]
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^^^It's not only true, but I'd like to add that it's safe to say the Safavids, let's say, revived the 'concept' of Iran, after roughly ten centuries, this time on a Shiite basis. However, please play attention the country they ruled was referred to as 'Iran', not oh-my-god-the-first-secular-country-of-the-world, namely, the republic of Azerbaijan (!), a country even the name of which is a 'hijacked' term, as Azarbaijan was (and is) the name of one of Iran's provinces, and a country which was basically fabricated by Uncle Joe.
And they fought damn bloody wars with 'Turkish motherland' of Pan-Turks (so they might have had a word with you) in the name of Iran, hand in hand with the christian Kafirs. Better yet, They had a pretty good attitude towards the Armenians (I bet this one is your favorite about them, lol).
And please, don't try to involve us in your mess with the Armenians, they are actually quite popular and a much-liked minority in today's Iran.

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No one can talk about them in form of modern day countries that exist today, you should grasp that first of all.
 
They were Azeris, spoke Azeri Turkish, and also came from territority of Azerbaijan. So was their military force, the Qizilbash, which is itself an Azeri word.

Azerbaijan is a region from Hamadan to Derbent, Azerbaijan is the land where Azeris live. Baku, Tabriz are all same to Azeris. Like said, stop falsifying history of Azeri people. When you act like this, then you wonder why some Azeris would want to separate.

First you should be able to respect Azeris, their idenity, their history. And not only you of course.

Last Edit: January 04, 2012, 04:02:45 PM by Tabrizi

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No one can talk about them in form of modern day countries that exist today, you should grasp that first of all.

Iran as a state has existed for several millenia with a remarkable, largely unparallelled continuity.

 
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They were Azeris,

Actually, the Safavids were originally a mystic order from north-western Iran, composed of people from various Iranian origins. There were Kurds among them, as well as Azaris.


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spoke Azeri Turkish, and also came from territority of Azerbaijan. So was their military force, the Qizilbash, which is itself an Azeri word.

Azarbaijan has always been a province of Iran. Therefore, if they came from Azarbaijan, they were Iranians. An Iranian must not necessarily have Farsi as his exclusive mother tongue, the concept of an Iran polity was never based on "ethno"-linguistic exclusivism, which is a backwards, primitive concept.


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Azerbaijan is a region from Hamadan to Derbent, Azerbaijan is the land where Azeris live.

The region you are referring to is not homogeneous from an "ethno"-linguistic point of view at all, since it is not only inhabited by Azari Iranians. Kurds, Armenians, Assyrians, Talysh, Tati, Gilaki, central Iranians, Lors, Bakhtiyaris, are also native to this area, not to mention the many Caucasian groups on the Daghestan-Azarbaijan border region, and most importantly, the great majority of Iranians who are in fact of mixed "ethno"-linguistic backgrounds.

So Azarbaijan is a region where Azaris and other Iranian (and some non-Iranian) peoples live, in addition to being a historic province of Iran.


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Baku, Tabriz are all same to Azeris.

This is not true, the loyalty of Azaris in Iran lies with their Iranian motherland and noone else. The same goes for Kurdish Iranians, Baluch Iranians, etc.

Linguistic links to former Iranian territories lost to Russian and British imperialism in the 19th century, does not imply political identification with the newly independent states formed on those territories.


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Like said, stop falsifying history of Azeri people. When you act like this, then you wonder why some Azeris would want to separate.

First you should be able to respect Azeris, their idenity, their history. And not only you of course.

There is nothing wrong nor disrespectful in what brother k-Alavi wrote. He actually confirmed the contributions of the Safavids to the creation of a modern Iranian state, yet you contend he is "falsifying" history, while his comment perfectly reflected the actual, established findings that pan-Turkist revisionism so desperately and amateurishly attempts to question. Revisionism which, by the way, is not taken seriously by anyone in Iran, least of all by Azari or other Iranians who speak a Turkic dialect.

Iranians (specially Azari Iranians) will not allow any foreign puppet regime working with extra-regional enemies (USA / Israel) to use ethnic bigotry to threaten Islamic solidarity and national integrity. If, or rather when, however, the Shia Muslim people of the republic of Azarbaijan choose to embrace their roots and join the Islamic Revolution and the Iranian motherland, they will be welcomed brotherly.
Last Edit: January 04, 2012, 09:20:41 PM by Rakhsh786

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Sorry but I got to tell you to stop reading fake wikipedia articles. Where have you ever heard of Kurds in Ardabil? There is only Azeris there. Safavids spoke Azeri language, including the court and military language. More importantly, the Safavid military consisted of Azeris. Shah Ismail wrote poems and divans in Azeri language, he wrote 1400 verses in Azeri Turkish, while only 50 in Persian language. There is no Kurdish trace of Safavids. Kurds were actually enemies of Safavids. Check battle of Dimdim.


 

Last Edit: January 04, 2012, 06:57:53 PM by Tabrizi

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Sieg Zeon
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 :lol: Hamadan Azeri? Hamadan is mixed with everyone, Lurs in the south, Kurds in the west, Persians in the east, Azeris in the north. It does not belong to just Azeris.
"By focusing our anger and sorrow, we are finally in a position where victory is within our grasp, and once again, our most cherished nation will flourish. Victory is the greatest tribute we can pay those who sacrifice their lives for us! Rise, our people, Rise! Take your sorrow, and turn it into anger! Zeon thirsts for the strength of its people! SIEG ZEON!"

-Gihren Zabi

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Sieg Zeon
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Iran was doing fine during the Zand era until your turkish Fag-jar(qajar) took over Iran through destruction and sold Iran off to everyone else. The Fag-jar were known homosexuals who would take young boys and have "relations" with them. Thats all you turks will be remembered as.....Monsters. In fact the Lion and khorshid emblem was taking from the Zand flag not the Qajar flag that the turks claim. Turks have so far only proven to be a bunch of killers, rapists, looters and commiters of mass genocide.

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Ya Ali maaddaad!!!
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 When you act like this, then you wonder why some Azeris would want to separate.


And there you have it!!! you finally showed your true face.
As we suspected from your first post on this forum, you had hidden agenda, ie to spread your separatism view on Iranian Azarbayejan , to win heart and minds for your conflict with Armenia and try to make up history for your beloved fake (because it has hijacked the name of an Iranian province) republic, which clearly you lake of.
And so you didnt intent to learn or contribute to this forum at all, like every body else does.

Now you must listen and listen very well, we in Iran we dont think alongside the sectarian lines like you and your Zio-Fascist Leader.
We ARE and we REMAIN first and foremost Irani and than Azari, Armani, Kord, Fars, Arab, Torkman, Lor etc.
We are proud of our history our culture and our religion. We have sens of unify Identity that you can even dream of.
And yes Iranian culture is a melting pot of  all our ppl , regardless whether they are a minority or majority of our population and that it Iran's strength.

Dont you dare to speak on behave of our Iranian-Azari population, generally they are the most watan-parast of all. They love Iran and they have defended Iran time and time again in the course of history.
you wont find a soul for your sectarian cause among them.
And yet you try to make us believe you are an Iranian as if that will give you carte blanche to infiltrate in this forum and spread your sectarian views. you cant call your self an Iranian when you dont have the best interest of Iran in heart.Heck you cant even call yourself a Human if you carry hate, disgust and anger in your heart.
And you prove me right about you having inferiority complex by saying that Azaris must respected( what you actually meant to say was that YOU feel you'r not respected.aaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhh I almost felt sorry for you.)

In future if you want to be more successful to infiltrate on Iranian fora or among Iranian society, I suggest you be more subtle about your intentions and educate yourself first about the Great nation of Iran an Iranian culture and history.

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So you cannot stand the history of Azeri people and their idenity? That's the problem, like said. Yes I care about my origin, like how you Persians do. When Persians do no problem, when Azeris do, it's bad.

You can easily talk about glory of ancient Persians, and it's not a problem.

Also, this is your post:

"Armenians like Iranians are a very old rooted people of the region, in contrary Azaris and Turks which are from Mongolian tribes they came in the region much much later. So dont try to make myth out of your azarbademjan, if anything Armanians are precedence over your Mongolian rooted people."

From what it look like, you are insulting all of Azeris, including Iranian ones.
Last Edit: January 04, 2012, 06:38:35 PM by Tabrizi

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:lol: Hamadan Azeri? Hamadan is mixed with everyone, Lurs in the south, Kurds in the west, Persians in the east, Azeris in the north. It does not belong to just Azeris.

Lur, do you know that Hamadan was one of centres of Seljuqs? You will find many, many Seljuq era stuff there, but not so much Lur or Kurd.

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Sieg Zeon
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Lur, do you know that Hamadan was one of centres of Seljuqs? You will find many, many Seljuq era stuff there, but not so much Lur or Kurd.

Hamadan was once all Median, it was the capital in fact of the Median empire way before you turks came to Iran. Why do turks always try to distort history with some fantasy turk version? You have clearly never been to Hamadan if you think the province is all turk.

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Sieg Zeon
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Just because a Turk invades and kills the native population does not make the place all of a sudden Turk land. In fact all of Azerbaijan region was all Iranian speakers until the turks came and killed most of their respected populations and replaced them with turks. The Kurds are an example of an Iranian people exiled from their homes by turks and sent to Khorasan region.

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There's a deep propaganda going on Iranian Azeris that they are Turkic and somehow have no connection with Persians. Pres of Azerbaijan said he is President of all Azeris including ones in Iran, which is truly ridiculous.

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Iran expects U.S. and 'Israel' attack from Azerbaijan
http://kavkazcenter.com/eng/content/2010/06/24/12240.shtml



http://www.washingtoninstitute.org/templateC05.php?CID=2287
http://www.rferl.org/content/The_Blooming_Friendship_Between_Azerbaijan_And_Israel/1978312.html
http://www.****.***/news/israel-and-azerbaijan-close-multi-million-dollar-arms-deal-1.254650

Jewish Azerbaijan

Shimon Perez visiting Azerbaijan (Part 1)
Հայաստանի Հանրապետություն

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Ya Ali maaddaad!!!
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@Tablizi
I see that you have deleted your earlier post.

LOL, you cant handle the pressure, can you?!

Do you know why you'r so popular,on IMF right now?That's because of your nonsense  posts blinded by hate and sens of inferiority.   
you shouldnt try to represent anyone not even yourself, if I were you.
Cause you sucked at it big time.
First you should calm yourself down, and think about what you want to say and what you want to achieve thereby.
Your lack of knowledge on the mater and poor ability to control your emotions while you try so desperately to prove your point by repetition of your distorted historical, ethnic geographical facts makes you the laughing stock on this forum.

So I guess we should thank you for entertainment. LOL
Last Edit: January 04, 2012, 07:51:59 PM by Azeraaxsh

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I think this guy was here and on another iranian forum before under various names, hes been banned numerous times if im not mistaken. He lives in his own sad little world.
Ya Ali

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Admins or whatever are free to check anything, no I have not been here before or another Iranian forum.

The latter part of your post actually applies to some of the people here I see so far.

Now what is the reason you (and others) suddenly became so offended?

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Azeraaxsh

What are you seriously talking about?

First you insult all Azeris, praise Armenians then talk about "integrity of Iran"? And of course you don't even have an idea of what your talking about in your last post.

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Last Edit: January 04, 2012, 11:07:31 PM by Rakhsh786

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Because we do know that Shah Ismail was grandson of Uzun Hasan, the Sultan of Agh-Qoyunlu Turkomans, whom by the way happen to be Azeri Turks. Shah Ismail came from the Agh-Qoyunlu lineage. Also, the actual Safavi ancestor, Sheihk Haydar Safavi was referred to as "Ey Tork-e Pir", I think you know what that means, and I think you also can see it in several sources.

Persian language was only used at court after the capital was moved to Isfahan, alongside Azeri of course. But before that, only Azeri was used at court. Even Safavid military titles were in Azeri. After reforms of Shah Abbas, new units were created, which actually continued into the Qajar era. Namely Topchu and Tufengchi, which means artillerymen and muskeeter respectively, in Azeri of course.

Safavids had strong Azeri idenity, and you cannot deny it in any way.





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Because we do know that Shah Ismail was grandson of Uzun Hasan, the Sultan of Agh-Qoyunlu Turkomans, whom by the way happen to be Azeri Turks. Shah Ismail came from the Agh-Qoyunlu lineage. Also, the actual Safavi ancestor, Sheihk Haydar Safavi was referred to as "Ey Tork-e Pir", I think you know what that means, and I think you also can see it in several sources.

Shah Esma'il I also happened to be the grandson of Sheikh Juneyd, Heydar Safavi's father, who was not of Aq-Qoyunlu lineage, nor even Turkoman as far as I know. Shah Esma'il I's case actually illustrates the mixity of "ethno"-linguistic backgrounds.


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Persian language was only used at court after the capital was moved to Isfahan, alongside Azeri of course

Farsi was the Safavid Empire's official and administrative language even before the capital was moved. So the Safavid state never used Azari Turkic in an exclusive manner. Much like the Ottomans didn't only use Farsi, although Ottoman elites did, while the official Turkish language of the Ottoman Empire was heavily influenced by Farsi, much more than contemporary Turkish.


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Even Safavid military titles were in Azeri. After reforms of Shah Abbas, new units were created, which actually continued into the Qajar era. Namely Topchu and Tufengchi, which means artillerymen and muskeeter respectively, in Azeri of course.

Safavids had strong Azeri idenity, and you cannot deny it in any way.

Again, I fail to see how any of this invalidates the fact that the Safavids, or Azaris in general, were / are Iranians. So the Safavids introduced news words of Azari Turkic origin into the military vocabulary, and spoke Azari Turkic (alongside Farsi) at the court, while using Farsi in the administration and everywhere else. How does that not make them Iranian? As said before, being Iranian never meant having Farsi as one's only mother tongue.

Labeling the Safavid Empire as a "Turkic" state, is like arguing that the Mughal Empire was a "Turkic" state, merely because the ruling dynasty was of Turkic descent, although rapidly "Indianized" and "Persianized". However "ethnicity" in the modern sense played no role then. Tribalism perhaps, but not "ethnicity". The identity of a state was determined by wholy different factors. See the European monarchies for instance, where the ruling dynasties have most often been of foreign descent, but that has not affected the identity of the state, neither before nor after the advent of modern nationalism and the concept of nation-states, which came to replace the defunct empires and city-states.

I never denied the existence of regional identities in Iran. However, the point is that these regional specificities go along with an overarching political identity as Iranians.

Contemporary Iran, as an Islamic Republic, is totally opposed to any form of ethnic bigotry, so accusations of Persian "ethno"-centrism are devoid of sense.
Last Edit: January 05, 2012, 01:05:58 AM by Rakhsh786

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Sorry but I got to tell you to stop reading fake wikipedia articles. Where have you ever heard of Kurds in Ardabil? There is only Azeris there. Safavids spoke Azeri language, including the court and military language. More importantly, the Safavid military consisted of Azeris. Shah Ismail wrote poems and divans in Azeri language, he wrote 1400 verses in Azeri Turkish, while only 50 in Persian language. There is no Kurdish trace of Safavids. Kurds were actually enemies of Safavids. Check battle of Dimdim.

You are an embarrassment.  And you should be embarrassed that you know little about history. 









Work together to defend Iran. 

همبستگی، همکاری، پیروزی
Last Edit: October 05, 2012, 07:58:16 AM by Tabriz Azari

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