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Offline Pasdar

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Iran to Unveil New Home-Made Ballistic Missiles Next Week
« on: May 18, 2011, 08:26:24 AM »
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Iran to Unveil New Home-Made Ballistic Missiles Next Week

TEHRAN (FNA)- Iran announced on Wednesday that it plans to unveil a number of newly-manufactured home-made ballistic missiles on May 24.

Speaking to reporters on Wednesday, Iranian Defense Minister Brigadier General Ahmad Vahidi said a number of new defense products, "including some vessels, ballistic missiles and new ammunitions will come into use on the occasion of Khorramshahr Liberation Anniversary (1982)".

Former Iraqi dictator Saddam Hussein's forces captured the port city of Khorramshahr on October 26, 1980 in a surprise attack on the early days of Iraqi-imposed war on Iran (1980-1988) but Iranian forces liberated the city on 3rd of Khordad (May 24, 1982) in a massive military operation named 'Beit-al-Moqaddas'.

Vahidi explained that the newly produced ballistic missiles to be unveiled on May 24 are the product of hard work and extensive research by Iranian experts, adding that they will be delivered to the Iranian Armed Forces in an official ceremony in the near future.

Iran has made giant progress in missile-production technology during the last decade.

In a recent case, Commander of the Islamic Revolution Guards Corps Major General Mohammad Ali Jafari announced in February that the IRGC has started mass-production of a recently-developed smart anti-ship ballistic missile.

"The IRGC's smart ballistic missiles are now in mass-production and this type of missiles can hit and destroy targets with high-precision," Jafari told reporters in a news conference here in Tehran in February.

"These new missiles enjoys supersonic speed and cannot be tracked or intercepted by enemy," the commander said, adding that missiles can hit targets 300km away with high-precision.

The Iranian Defense Ministry in October delivered the third generation of home-made Fateh-110 high-precision ballistic missiles to the IRGC Aerospace Force.

"The operational movement of the missile unit of the IRGC Aerospace Force will be remarkably boosted by these missiles," Vahidi said during a ceremony at the time.

He further announced that Iran plans to test the fourth generation of Fateh-110 missiles in the near future.

In September, Iran announced that the country has successfully test-fired the third generation of Fateh-110 missiles.

The Fateh-110 is a short-range, road-mobile, solid-propellant, high-precision ballistic missile with advanced navigation and control systems.

The Fateh-110 has been designed and developed by the Iranian experts in the Defense Ministry's Aerospace Organization and has not been modeled on any foreign product.

The Iranian defense ministry has made great achievements in designing and producing missiles, including the surface-to-surface solid-fuel Sejjil missiles, the long-range Shahab-3 ballistic missile which has a range of up to 2,000 km, and Zelzal and Fateh missiles.

The new test came days after Iran test-fired a new type surface to surface, cruise missile, named Qiam 1.

Iran has been pushing an arms development program in recent years in a bid to reach self-sufficiency. Tehran launched its arms development program during the 1980-88 Iraqi imposed war on Iran to compensate for a US weapons embargo. Since 1992, Iran has produced its own jet fighters and armored vehicles as well as radar-avoiding missiles and other high-tech weapons.

Yet, Iranian officials have always stressed that the country's military and arms programs serve defensive purposes and should not be perceived as a threat to any other country.

http://english.farsnews.com/newstext.php?nn=9002280573

Offline parthenon

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Re: Iran to Unveil New Home-Made Ballistic Missiles Next Week
« Reply #1 on: May 18, 2011, 12:14:33 PM »
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Maybe there will be a  *S*A*T*E*L*L*I*T*E*-KILLER  this time.

Advantage:
1) although definitely a Weapon of Mass Destruction (in $$-value at least... all those sats totaling  hundreds of billions perhaps), it's completely BLOODLESS (OK, so you have to warn them space station cosmonauts beforehand)
2) no sanctions and military threats based on alleged(!) "dual use" of nuclear energy
3) much cheaper I guess

The message being:
DON'T EVEN THINK OF BOMBING OUR DUAL USE ASSETS (in other words, EVERYTHING; look at Iraq, Libya) OR ELSE WE WILL GO AFTER YOUR OWN DUAL USE ASSETS, i.e. your billion dollar satellites !!!!

http://demagocracy.livejournal.com
http://asymmetronix.livejournal.com

"Bunker"Bill, aka the "Member Formerly Known as Parthenon" (MFKAP)

Offline Pasdar

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Re: Iran to Unveil New Home-Made Ballistic Missiles Next Week
« Reply #2 on: May 18, 2011, 02:18:10 PM »
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An anti-sat missile, is not ballistic, so no anti-sat yet.

Online Ayyash

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Re: Iran to Unveil New Home-Made Ballistic Missiles Next Week
« Reply #3 on: May 18, 2011, 05:34:02 PM »
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Perhaps they're talking about the Khalij Fars since the article says "newly manufactured", not necessarily "newly designed"
Where i blog on the Iranian military
http://thearkenstone.blogspot.com/

Offline Eagle2009

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Re: Iran to Unveil New Home-Made Ballistic Missiles Next Week
« Reply #4 on: May 18, 2011, 11:10:56 PM »
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Parthenon,

Just for clarification, ASATs today are only a risk to Low Earth Orbit satellites. This means that GPS and Communication satellites (the most important and costly by far) are safe because of their much higher orbits. No ASAT every designed or proposed has the ability to target any satellites other than LEO and for good reason. To be able to hit Medium and Geostationary orbit targets you need a very large rocket which isn't subtle and could easily be detected before launch. Not to mention the time it would take for the ASAT to reach that altitude would be more than enough time for the targetted satellite to manuever out of the way. Therefore for the time being, ASATs are only a risk to LEO satellites like "spy satellites".

Pasdar,

China's ASAT tested several years ago is believed to be based on a ballistic missile. It is believed to based on the KT-1 Small Space Launch vehicle which is inturn based on the Chinese JL-1 SLBM. So a ballistic missile based ASAT is clearly possible, its just not as subtle as an air-launched. So while a ballistic missile based ASAT is not strictly an BM anymore, one could call it such without being too much of a strength. 
"I never did give anybody hell. I just told the truth, and they thought it was hell."
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Offline M-ATF

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Re: Iran to Unveil New Home-Made Ballistic Missiles Next Week
« Reply #5 on: May 19, 2011, 01:00:52 AM »
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Ayyash,
you're right, it isnt a new ballistic, it is just delivery of a ballistic missile that design and tests of it has been done and now has been mass produced.

here is persian version of this report

Quote
سردار وحیدی خبر داد؛ تحویل سری جدید موشکهای بالستیک در 3خرداد
وزیر دفاع و پشتیبانی نیروهای مسلح در پاسخ به سوالی مبنی بر این‌که گفته می‌شود که برخی از مقامات سازمان ملل مدعی شده‌اند بین ایران و کره شمالی فناوری موشکی رد و بدل می‌شود، این موضوع را رد کرد.

به گزارش گروه دفاع و امنیت مشرق به نقل از فارس، سردار احمد وحیدی در حاشیه جلسه امروز چهارشنبه هیئت وزیران در جمع خبرنگاران در پاسخ به سئوالی در خصوص ادعای غربی‌ها مبنی بر تبادل تسلیحات موشکی بین کره شمالی و جمهوری اسلامی ایران، این موضوع را رد کرد و اظهار داشت: ایران در عرصه صنعت دفاعی کاملا خودکفا است و نیازی به کشورهای دیگری ندارد و هیچ چیزی در این حوزه بین ما تبادل نشده است.

در روزهای اخیر سازمان ملل در گزارشی مدعی شد جمهوری اسلامی ایران و کره شمالی با همدیگر در عرصه صنایع موشکی تبادل کالا داشتند.

*برخی شناورها و یک سری از موشک‌های بالستیک 3 خرداد مورد بهره‌برداری قرار می‌گیرد

خبرنگاری از وزیر دفاع و پشتیبانی درباره آخرین اخبار مربوط به صنعت دفاعی سؤال کرد که وحیدی پاسخ داد: در سالروز آزاد سازی خرمشهر (3 خرداد) پروژه‌های جدیدی در حوزه دفاعی مورد بهره‌برداری قرار می‌گیرند که برخی شناورها و یک سری از موشک‌های بالستیک و برخی از عنوان مهمات جدید از جمله آنها است.

وی درباره ویژگی‌های موشک‌های بالستیک جدید گفت که این سلاح‌ها جزء سلاح‌هایی است که قبلا تحقیقات آنها به ثمره رسیده‌ و اکنون به مرحله تحویل رسیده و طی مراسمی به بهره‌برداری می‌رسد.

Offline Catsoo

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Re: Iran to Unveil New Home-Made Ballistic Missiles Next Week
« Reply #6 on: May 19, 2011, 03:00:15 AM »
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One of the missiles is the new version of Fateh-110. IRGC has been continuously working on this short range tactical missile
to improve its accuracy. Given the short range of most US and hostile Arab targets , this missile is well suited for IRGC.

Catsoo 

Offline M-ATF

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Re: Iran to Unveil New Home-Made Ballistic Missiles Next Week
« Reply #7 on: May 19, 2011, 05:32:08 AM »
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my guess is Qiam-1

Offline YMJ

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Re: Iran to Unveil New Home-Made Ballistic Missiles Next Week
« Reply #8 on: May 19, 2011, 07:29:54 AM »
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Parthenon,

Just for clarification, ASATs today are only a risk to Low Earth Orbit satellites. This means that GPS and Communication satellites (the most important and costly by far) are safe because of their much higher orbits. No ASAT every designed or proposed has the ability to target any satellites other than LEO and for good reason. To be able to hit Medium and Geostationary orbit targets you need a very large rocket which isn't subtle and could easily be detected before launch. Not to mention the time it would take for the ASAT to reach that altitude would be more than enough time for the targetted satellite to manuever out of the way. Therefore for the time being, ASATs are only a risk to LEO satellites like "spy satellites".



If you explode a rocket in the path of a satellite, it's enough for the debris to do damage.

You just need to damage a satellite, not directly hit it.
"There is no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance" - Imam Ali (as)

"''melate ma neshan dade'ast ke be hadaf haye khod momen, va dar rahe on, ta nesar'e jaan eestade'ast.. chenin melati, az america va az hiiich ghodrati nemitars'ad, va be yaari'e khoda neshan khahad daad ke pirooz az on' e hagh, va momenan be hagh ast!"

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Offline Pasdar

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Re: Iran to Unveil New Home-Made Ballistic Missiles Next Week
« Reply #9 on: May 19, 2011, 08:16:34 AM »
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Pasdar,

China's ASAT tested several years ago is believed to be based on a ballistic missile. It is believed to based on the KT-1 Small Space Launch vehicle which is inturn based on the Chinese JL-1 SLBM. So a ballistic missile based ASAT is clearly possible, its just not as subtle as an air-launched. So while a ballistic missile based ASAT is not strictly an BM anymore, one could call it such without being too much of a strength. 
Of course, any missile initially made for any purpose can be changed, good or bad, to serve another purpose, but the point is... it will not have its previous designation. No anti-sat missile can be introduced as a ballistic missile.

An anti-sat missile attempts to reach the orbit of a satellite, either by firing it at the right moment so they can rendezvous with zero relative speed, or the missile will be sent in the opposite direction, with relative speeds of more than 14 km/s. Both have their advantages and disadvantages, but the point is.. the missile will not be doing what a ballistic missile is made for... to hit a target somewhere on earth by following an elliptic flight path.

Offline parthenon

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Re: Iran to Unveil New Home-Made Ballistic Missiles Next Week
« Reply #10 on: May 19, 2011, 10:53:36 AM »
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@Eagle2009; re:"geo-stationary sats"

I knew that, I knew that... NOT !
Iranians are smart people, I bet they'll figure it out.

The operative term here would be "geo-STATIONARY" I believe and I heard they invented this nifty gadget called "laser", as in HIGH-ENERGY LASER.

Say half of the geo-stat sats are out-of-reach (145E to 35W) and then you've got atmosphere attenuation, multiplied by.....uhmmmm. OK, what say ye I do the math, consult with dr.Evil and get back to you later?



Offline sami86

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Re: Iran to Unveil New Home-Made Ballistic Missiles Next Week
« Reply #11 on: May 19, 2011, 04:32:59 PM »
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why they always show the same weapons

Offline Eagle2009

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Re: Iran to Unveil New Home-Made Ballistic Missiles Next Week
« Reply #12 on: May 19, 2011, 07:28:00 PM »
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Parthenon,

Except from what I have read of military lasers, they aren't any today that reach a target at that altitude and do any damage. The Chinese are believed to have fairly powerful "blinding" lasers that can temporarily blind passing US spy satellites but such satellites are normally in LEO (any orbit below 1000km or so) whereas GEO orbits are 36,000km. So I find it unlikely that even a ground based laser could do the job unless it had a small nuclear reactor attached to it, which would then make it an easy target to destroy (say with the US Prompt Global Strike being developed).

YMJ,

Yes but how is the wreckage supposed to reach the satellite? Unless the weapon is "exploded" near the same orbit it's unlike the wreckage from it will ever reach the high orbits of MEO and GEO. Therefore you still need a large rocket to get to the needed orbit for even wreckage to reach such satellites and such a launch will easily be detected, tracked and possibly even destroyed before it ever reaches it target. Not to mention the chances of collateral damage to other nations satellies, both civilian and military, is guranteed. I don't think the Chinese or Russians will be very please if Iran hits their satellites while trying to take out a few American ones.
« Last Edit: May 19, 2011, 07:30:59 PM by Eagle2009 »

Offline parthenon

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Re: Iran to Unveil New Home-Made Ballistic Missiles Next Week
« Reply #13 on: May 20, 2011, 01:36:45 PM »
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@Eagle2009

With retroreflector(s) on the moon (300.000km from the earth) and GEO-sats at one tenth of that distance, I suppose it wouldn't be beyond the capabilities (accuracy and range) of your average physics lab to bounce a beam back from one of those sats  -BTW, can someone explain how some countries (Iran?) manage to occasionally jam a "FoxNews" sat ?!-  so the only challenge left would be yield. At 100-1000Kw this would indeed have to be a major energy plant (preferably NOT a nuke station because of the NPT), but you can hide it in one of those many tunnels and caves "el Magnifico Presidente" has been digging the past 6 years.

You say the Chinese and the Russians won't be pleased?
But that's the whole point of a DOOMSDAY DEVICE (and a "bloodless" one at that): it's either "everybody happy" OR "everybody sad". The Chinese and the Russians ought to finally have the balls to make it clear they won't tolerate anymore of those fig-leaved "1973" resolutions !

Offline Eagle2009

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Re: Iran to Unveil New Home-Made Ballistic Missiles Next Week
« Reply #14 on: May 20, 2011, 07:51:48 PM »
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Parthenon,

For one, you should know that most experts agree the MEGAWATT class Laser fitted in the Airborne Laser system (a modified Boeing 747) can in theory hit LEO targets but is likely unable to damage any satellites higher than that. If a Megawatt class laser can't do the job, a Kilowatt class laser has no chance. If said laser has IN orbit to begin with yes (see US Strategic Defense Initiative) but a ground based one no.

Your mention of the "retroreflectors" puzzles me since it has nothing to do with what I am saying. Clearly a fairly weak laser beam can reach such orbits, the issues is retaining enough energy along the way to be able to actually do any damage. Remember a fairly simple 100kw lazer on Earth can destroy artillery rounds, small UAVs, and similar size targets. Even the power Megawatt class laser fitted to the ABL doesn't have the power to destroy ballistic missiles (as many mistaken believe), simply the power to weaken the steel alloy skin of said missile and cause it to structurely fail. The loss of energy for a laser travelling through the Earth's atmosphere greatly degrades and as such their abilities to damage a target higher than LEO would require a huge amount of power. Such a system likely could not be hidden since the power needed would require a fairly large power plant (whether natural gas, diesel, or nuclear powered) which are difficult if not downright impossible to hide which means they can be destroyed.

Offline parthenon

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Re: Iran to Unveil New Home-Made Ballistic Missiles Next Week
« Reply #15 on: May 21, 2011, 10:32:04 AM »
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Eagle,
My mistake, my estimates were 50 off (5 -50MW) but I'm no laser- nor sat-engineer and neither are you obviously because your arguments fail to convince me this time.

You're comparing apples to oranges:
1) geo-STATIONARY, non-aerodynamic targets to
2) hypersonic, aerodynamic (i.e. slanted surfaces all-over except for fins, if present) ones.

Target 2 requires much more energy because chances are hits will be
1) of short duration (you're tracking a moving object at hypersonic speed!)
2) much of the energy will be scattered because of slanted surfaces

3) the only advantage is its speed ("paradoxically") because as you said, you have to weaken its structural integrity just a bit to let the whole thing disintegrate.

The disadvantage of my idea, which has nothing to do with the TYPE of target, would indeed be atmospheric attenuation.

Offline parthenon

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Re: Iran to Unveil New Home-Made Ballistic Missiles Next Week
« Reply #16 on: May 21, 2011, 10:49:04 AM »
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BTW, there are some large ship engines even exceeding the 5MW lower limit I mentioned above.

Offline comandantecarlos

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Re: Iran to Unveil New Home-Made Ballistic Missiles Next Week
« Reply #17 on: May 21, 2011, 04:37:21 PM »
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I think it is also possible to produce energy explosives.

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Re: Iran to Unveil New Home-Made Ballistic Missiles Next Week
« Reply #18 on: May 21, 2011, 07:29:22 PM »
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Eagle has some points about LEO and GTO . And also size and deployment problem of  large missile . But the step from present position for Iran launcher to higher orbit is not impossible . A  LEO rocket with elliptical orbit , reaches high altitude of  GPS orbit as it swings around . All that is needed is a little push for orbit transfer . So a small powered third stage kinetic impactor on top of present rocket may do the job . Alternatively a stronger fist or second stage or addition of boosters like the Japanese system may do the trick . As far as hiding rocket and time of exposure and fuelling , this is not problem either . All Iran needs to do , is strike first ! Or early on in any war , before enemy fully deploys .

There are many other effective ways ( how effective is a matter of debate) of disabling GPS . Among the simplest is hiding high value targets among mountains , in GPS blind spots . Jamming signals . And beam weapons . But beam weapons are difficult and expensive new technology !

Importantly , for Iran , how effective any anti-GPS system may be , or may not be , has a significance on the development of short or long range , anti-air , anti-ship and anti-sub weapons Iran has to make . If for example Iran is able to effectively counter GPS  and GPS guided weapons , the American long range and first strike weapons like the AGM-158-JASSM air launched cruise missile with 1000 Km range or older ship or sub launched cruise missiles with 2500 Km range that rely on GPS will be ineffective . As will AGM-129 ACM with 3700 Km range . ( even if latter is adapted for conventional attack) .

The reason is that TERCOM can be countered and INS gives very poor accuracy at long range . In this case Americans will be forced to attack at close range with  laser guided weapons . This means they loose the advantage of stand off attack and then the tactic for Iran should be to develop dog-fighters and short range interceptors . On the other hand if GPS can not be disabled then long range interceptors and missiles and ships  etc , must be made . In an ideal world all weapons should be made . But if money is short then choices have to be made .



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inertial_navigation_system
Error is inconsistent with my prime function .

Offline Aspahbod

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Re: Iran to Unveil New Home-Made Ballistic Missiles Next Week
« Reply #19 on: May 22, 2011, 07:41:55 AM »
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M-ATF's prediction was true. They delivered Qiam-1 to IRGC:

http://www.iranmilitaryforum.net/index.php?topic=8498.msg76245#new

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Re: Iran to Unveil New Home-Made Ballistic Missiles Next Week
« Reply #20 on: May 22, 2011, 06:15:54 PM »
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@commandantecarlos: what do you mean by "energy explosives"


Re: Qiam-1

I'm surprised it went into production, thought it was a "proof of concept" model to experiment (hence liquid-fueled) with vane-less BM's.

So why no vanes?
1)  (from the press release) "...easier to fuel"... Why?
2)  "...greater speed"... obvious!
3)  storage in silo's?
4a) speculation1: quasi-ballistic trajectory with manoeuvrability in atmospheric(?) coasting phase but especially in max.speed terminal phase. Vanes would probably break off when trying to steer against atmospheric pressure.
4b) speculation2: will the "triconic" ("outer") nosecone with warhead1 seperate and continue unpowered on the original course, while the missile veers off with another "inner" nosecone (and warhead 2) on top to a second target?... a kind of simple MIRV (multiple independently targetable reentry vehicle) if you will.


Offline comandantecarlos

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Re: Iran to Unveil New Home-Made Ballistic Missiles Next Week
« Reply #21 on: May 22, 2011, 08:52:26 PM »
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laser#As_weapons
The laser is excited to be enough energy. The powder gives you energy. Think of the air bag
« Last Edit: May 22, 2011, 08:55:06 PM by comandantecarlos »

 

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